What if the likes were never really the point?

This episode brings together Tanya, 61, a theater, dance, and opera artist, educator, and longtime immigrant-rights activist, and Julius, 28, a filmmaker whose debut feature premiered to a packed community screening last year. Together they trace where validation has come from across two very different creative careers — newspaper reviews and word of mouth for Tanya, likes and algorithm-driven visibility for Julius — and what happens when that outside approval disappears.

Tanya shares the mentor whose unexpected praise shaped her entire career, and the theater critic who tried and failed to shake her sense of self. Julius opens up about making his film, “Pancho,” as he grieved his father, and the moment his mother’s reaction at the premiere told him it was all worth it. The conversation moves through comparison, ego, generational pressure, and the shift both guests describe: from needing to be seen by others to learning no one can validate you but you.

Guests

Tanya — 61, artist and educator working across theater, dance, and opera. A longtime traveler and immigrant-rights activist, she also fosters and rehabilitates rescue dogs. Sober since 25, she describes her 30s as the point she realized validation has to come from within.

Julius — 28, filmmaker and recent Cal State LA TVF (writing option) graduate. Wrote and made his debut feature film, “Pancho” — a story about an immigrant vigilante in East LA — the year after his father passed away. Currently working in coffee while building his filmmaking career.